142. Judge Peter Sakai on How Prop A & B Could Revitalize San Antonio’s Eastside

Bob Rivard [00:00:03]:
Welcome to Big City, Small Town, the weekly podcast all about San Antonio and the people who make it go and grow. I'm your host, Bob Rivard. Today's guest is Bexar County Judge Peter Sakai. These days he's one of the community's best known elected leaders. He was elected to his four year term as county judge as a Democrat in November 2023, defeating the Republican candidate and Bexar County Commissioner Trish Debary. Judge Sakai has said in the past he'll seek a second term in November 2026 as he continues to push for greater east side development, implementation of rapid bus lines and other initiatives. We'll hear more about in today's episode. But it was Judge Sakai's long groundbreaking years as a district court judge here that made him a household name.

Bob Rivard [00:00:47]:
As a judge, he reformed the process for legal adoption of children. And it was his vision that led to creation of the Family Drug Court, the Early Childhood Court. In the college bound docket, Sakai has long been known as a legal champion of women and children victimized by family violence. Judge Sakai is also the embodiment of a story in America and that's called immigration that I like to bring up at every chance I get. Judge he's the grandson of Japanese immigrants whose own father was incarcerated in one of the Japanese internment camps by federal authorities during World War II. And his own upbringing in the Rio Grande Valley led to his enrollment in the law school at the University of Texas at Austin. In a high successful career since then as an attorney, prosecutor, and then, and then Judge and now he presides over the Bexar County's Commissioners Court. And the big issue for Judge Sakai and Bexar county commissioners that are engaged in today is the future of the Frost bank center, the San Antonio spurs and the San Antonio Stock show and Rodeo.

Bob Rivard [00:01:50]:
With early voting set to start on October 20th in the county's November 4th election, many observers, including myself, believe the future of the spurs in San Antonio could hang in the balance. Judge Peter Sakai, welcome to big city, small town.

Judge Peter Sakai [00:02:05]:
Thank you, Bob Rivard. It's a pleasure to be here.

Bob Rivard [00:02:07]:
You're a very busy man and we appreciate you finding a little bit of time to spend with us today.

Judge Peter Sakai [00:02:11]:
Well, I think it's important for me to be here to help explain and kind of correct the record, so to speak, in regards to our election. As you've noted on referendum Proposition A and B, which affect our community, the east side and our community as a whole for the entire county well, let's.

Bob Rivard [00:02:28]:
Get right into that and tell me what you think in the public record needs to be corrected and go over the two propositions one by one and what's at stake as voters get ready to go to the polls.

Judge Peter Sakai [00:02:41]:
Bob, let me break it down as best I can. The county has called for an election which I believe puts it in the hands of the voters. There are two referendums, Referendum A and Referendum B. It's also called Proposition, so I want to let the public know those are interchangeable and the referendums provide for this. It is the use of the county venue tax. It is, which consists of a hotel occupancy tax and the rental car tax. It is the tourist tax. It is paid for people who stay in a hotel or, or rent a car.

Judge Peter Sakai [00:03:21]:
There is zero impact on homeowners and renters. This has nothing to do with homeowner property tax. So one correction of the record is it will not affect homeowners and renters. This is not a homeowner property tax, it's a tourist tax. And in that referendum, in both referendums A and B, by law, there's going to be a little disclaimer on this. This is a tax increase. So let me also correct the record in regards to what people say. Well, this is going to put this all on the San Antonio local taxpayers.

Judge Peter Sakai [00:03:59]:
No, as I indicated, it's a tourist tax. And so the hotel occupancy tax is currently 1.75%. The voters are asked to increase that to 2%, which is what all major cities use in order to develop their tourism economic development packages. All the major cities are using that for that particular purpose.

Bob Rivard [00:04:21]:
That's the state mandated ceiling on the visitor tax.

Judge Peter Sakai [00:04:25]:
And to give you context, 1.75% on an average $200. I don't know, you may stay lower or higher, Bob, on your taste of choice there, but a $200 hotel bill at 1.75% is $3.50 a night. To go to 2% is $4. My math says that's a 50 cent difference in order to make an impact on the east side and on the downtown. In regards to the referendum, Referendum B is not Project Marvel. I understand much, much confusion and that the name Project Marvel has been put about that is a City of San Antonio project and the city is going to have to try to help explain that for the voters. But for the referendum, this is support for the county facilities, the Frostbank center, the Joe Harry Freeman Coliseum and the Coliseum grounds. And two, whatever money is left over for A new spurs venue, wherever it may be.

Judge Peter Sakai [00:05:27]:
They have obviously identified a downtown location. And so the first correction of the record is why do you have to put all this money on the east side and for those county facilities? Bob, not doing anything is unacceptable. Why? Because if we fail to upgrade, renovate and keep the Frostbank center viable, it could become the next Astrodome, which is that place in Houston that was the eighth one of the world and now is a dump and an eyesore. I cannot allow that to happen as county judge. Two is, we went to the San Antonio Rodeo and we said, you are the second major tenant on those county facilities using the Coliseum grounds. If you go there, as we know, you go there, you leave. There is no economic generating businesses there. And so what we want for the reimagining of the east side is that the rodeo and the spurs have literally outgrown each other.

Judge Peter Sakai [00:06:30]:
The rodeo needs to expand its program. They bring in nearly $375 million a year just on their one month. Can you imagine they have put a business plan together that would make it year round, sustainable. People go, the rodeo is going to go one month. No, it will bring all the rodeo industry and they go. What do you mean? Look at the Fort Worth stockyards. That used to be a dilapidated stockyard and now has become economic growth for the city and county. There in Fort Worth, you go to Las Vegas, to the South Point Casino Resort.

Judge Peter Sakai [00:07:02]:
Rodeo. Rodeo is a major sports industry. And so we have an opportunity to frame this election in this way. This is a east side, downtown revitalization of economic development by county city partnership. Because we also understand that the Coliseum Advisory Board, what we call the cab, is a county entity and they run their car shows and their comic Cons. They run a lot of activities there. But we're going to have to change that facility from asphalt, cement and barns with dirt floors to multipurpose venues to allow growth in the development of businesses, more specifically restaurants, small businesses. I want people to be able to come to those county facilities when the spurs are going to vacate Frostbank.

Judge Peter Sakai [00:07:56]:
They have clearly indicated they will be leaving the Frostbank Center. They have given us up to six years in order to develop a plan. And that's what this referendum lays the foundation, so to speak. And that's the reason why when the spurs first came and asked me to call election earlier this year, I pushed back, said, no, we need to make sure that we have a plan. Because I said the revitalization of the east side was first and foremost and that's what this, I believe this is what this election is about. And then we also understand the spurs are a business. They feel that their business plan requires them to have a new facility. I don't question that because I value the spurs for what they do economically for this community as a major employer.

Judge Peter Sakai [00:08:39]:
But more importantly, the philanthropic contribution the spurs make. The Spurs, Coyote, the players and the organization itself brings so much to the community. And so when the spurs made a commitment that they would put in 500 million to a new spurs, their own money, along with the city and the county. The county put. After we took the money for the county facilities, Proposition A, we gave them what was left with a cap, 25% cap up to $311 million. The spurs have also included in their package $1.5 billion of development, private development around the particular venue that they're going to build out. And so there's nearly a $2 billion investment wherever the spurs locate. And so for our $311 million, I get $2 billion back of private equity.

Judge Peter Sakai [00:09:32]:
It's the same template that we made for the baseball stadium downtown. The Western Urban Group is going to invest into downtown, near downtown, in fact, just down the street from here.

Bob Rivard [00:09:44]:
That's right.

Judge Peter Sakai [00:09:45]:
They're going to put in $1 billion which will build up that whole area that's vacant land now. So there'll be a new baseball stadium, there'll be development, high rise hotels, office, multi use venues there. And so I'm just really excited by the opportunities, the vision, because we can go. I'm going to pause so that you can ask some questions. But there is also a vision for the east side, not only for the county facilities, but across the street at Willow Springs Golf Course. Can we, through a master developer, public private partnership, find an anchor tenant like a hotel? And can we change that area with Salado Creek beautiful nature area, turn it into a JW Marriott, turn it into the Hyatt Hill Country. And then with further vision and planning and incentives from the county to city, federal or state, can we de industrialize that area? Because there are some natural barriers there that keep that development. But I felt so strongly that we needed to fulfill the promise to the east side.

Judge Peter Sakai [00:10:50]:
So I've made the east side the first. That's the reason why the spurs are getting whatever the balance of the money out of the county. Venue tax, a tourist tax.

Bob Rivard [00:10:59]:
I think it's a great vision and I think there's an awful lot of us who lived in the city in the late 90s. Judge, in early 2000s when the vote was originally passed to build the. I guess it was called the SPC arena originally. This really is the opportunity to give the east side the kind of economic development that we had all hoped for that didn't. Didn't develop 25 years ago.

Judge Peter Sakai [00:11:20]:
Right. And I would encourage you, if you haven't already, to talk to the rodeo. Cody Davenport to see you.

Bob Rivard [00:11:26]:
We had him on the podcast.

Judge Peter Sakai [00:11:28]:
All right. So, you know, you know, and you probably got a description of what the rodeo has committed to the east side community. They are running equine horse programs as we speak, and they want to continue that. I got a pledge that they will sponsor FFA4H clubs for those kids in the east side so that they can raise animals and take the advantage of what that does for our community. And then recognize that the San Antonio rodeo is giving out about $12 million a year in scholarships and. And they have focused in on the kids on the east side at Fort Sam Houston High School, St. Philip's College, and the historically black colleges. So the rodeo has lived up to its commitment to really invest in the east side.

Judge Peter Sakai [00:12:13]:
But I'm looking at a bigger picture, a bigger vision. Can we put the proposition A referendum A as a foundational piece? Basically, can we make that area pearl, like, can we make it so that people come and stay and spend a day? Can we reform and make sure that the Frost bank center is upgraded so it's going to have to compete? And that has been a criticism. Well, how's it going to compete? It's going to compete because we've got to make sure that technology, the infrastructure, H Vac, all that things are taken care of. But more importantly, look at what's the advantage of that. It's got tremendous parking. We can beat any venue on that, I promise. And so I'm excited about the Coliseum Advisory Board because they will expand their process so that we can make that whole area sustainable all to itself. It becomes an economic generator in bringing in more sales tax, alcohol tax, and all sorts of funding sources so that we then reinvest.

Judge Peter Sakai [00:13:17]:
That's my commitment as county judge, to reinvest those monies that we are created by these. This economic generation project. A once in a lifetime, in my opinion, to give back to the community and make sure the east side is taken care of along. And we hope that also, too, because I said earlier, a eastside downtown revitalization of economic development by county, city partnership. I see that we can make this a win, win for our community.

Bob Rivard [00:13:47]:
How bothered are you by the disinformation out there that you and other elected officials are allocating major capital funds to these projects that otherwise could go to inner city anti poverty programs like housing and education and daycare and infrastructure improvements. That some of the opponents of the Proposition A and B are out campaigning saying this is money that could otherwise go to go to other, other needs in the community that are very legitimate but that we know state legislators have put certain boundaries on how these taxes can be used.

Judge Peter Sakai [00:14:25]:
That's exactly right. You just said it. The rule of law. Bob Brevard and as a former district court judge, I am bound by the rule of law. I am bound to follow US Constitution and the Texas Constitution. Make sure that we follow the law. The law requires that the county venue tax must go to venues and it must be tied to tourist economic development. We cannot divert this money to those projects.

Judge Peter Sakai [00:14:50]:
That's the reason why it is a multi phase process to where if we improve the county facilities, create a new opportunity at the Willow Springs Golf Course, de industrialize that area. That's when we can come back and put housing, schools, hospitals, law enforcement academies, whatever the community feels is important. That's the opportunity. But it's not a one shot because the law does not allow that. And I've got to push back. The other day, well, they used the last one, I think 2008 on the repairs of the Frost bank center and they added the Tobin, they added the Riverwalk north, they added the Mission Trails. I just go on record, I don't want to build another Tobin. I don't want to add any more upgrades of the Riverwalk or the Mission Trails.

Judge Peter Sakai [00:15:40]:
Those are beautiful institutions that were created by that particular case. But it was not in regards to housing, roads, drainage, flooding, those basic necessities we're going to have to grow as a community and what the budget are going to have to allow. And so those are the opportunities that hopefully can come about with this particular election.

Bob Rivard [00:16:05]:
And yet you as county judge feel somewhat constrained by how much you can quote campaign close quotes. In other words, you can, you can, you're comfortable being out there trying to differentiate facts from disinformation, trying to explain the ballot propositions. And I think that's important because they're written in legalese which confuses voters. You wish you could just simply post the questions, but it's not that simple on the ballot language. But, but you do feel somewhat constrained as, as a, an elected, a state elected official for, for Bexar county of what you can advocate for in terms of exhorting voters to get out and approve the two.

Judge Peter Sakai [00:16:43]:
The same law, Bob, prohibits me from advocating a position. So I can't tell people to vote yes or no or against. I have to educate and push back on misinformation or incorrect information. And I respect those people who have disagreements. But I really want the voters to have the correct information so they can make an educated decision on the referendums A and B. And at the bottom line, Bob, I will respect the decision of the voters. We will respect the institution that majority rules. Despite all the voices out there that will either say vote for it or vote against it.

Judge Peter Sakai [00:17:26]:
I want the voters to have. That's the reason why I'm here today talking with you.

Bob Rivard [00:17:31]:
Judge. Have you met with the cops Metro team? And how did that go and how did it.

Judge Peter Sakai [00:17:36]:
You know, I have a long standing relationship with Casa Metro and that goes back to my years as a children's court judge and the commitment I did to protect families and to protect children and to improve the system. And so I start with that. And so when this referendum election came in, they came in and I had at least two meetings, I believe, where we shared and had a discussion much like we're having now. At the end of the second conversation, they took a position that I thought they were going to be able to support Proposition A because they support the revitalization of the east side. And I think their official position is they take their being neutral. But I believe that they saw the merits of what I was trying to do, accepting my vision for the east side. B, they took a pretty hard line stance. Do not provide any support to San Antonio spurs and so I helped explain to them that I saw the spurs as a valuable corporate citizen and more importantly a philanthropic organization that continues to give back to this community in major ways.

Judge Peter Sakai [00:18:47]:
Either the Spurs Coyote shows up your functions or the spurs players show up or they give individual contributions. We know that 25 plus players all the way in the past, the Stars live here and are contributing to our local economy. So it's not this, well, they're here and they're gone. And so the spurs are a major employer and I truly believe that is also a key distinction. Bob, I just came from a trip to Japan on economic development. My second trip, the first trip yielded a Japanese business coming here called American Katera who established their corporate headquarters here in San Antonio and they've opened up shop heavy industrial steel manufacturing. I've got a second Japanese manufacturing company that will be a manufacturer for plastics. I talked to many Japanese businesses there in Japan.

Judge Peter Sakai [00:19:43]:
Guess what? They're not very always familiar with the market, so to speak, of what San Antonio is really all about. But I tell you what, every one of them knew about the San Antonio spurs and their favorite player was Tim Duncan and David Robinson, not in that order, but that was the name. We are known internationally because of the San Antonio Spurs. And so there is great economic value that the San Antonio spurs bring to our community. I cannot allow the spurs to leave. It is apparent that the San Antonio Rodeo and the San Antonio spurs have basically outgrown each other. The Rodeo is desperate in order to expand its operations.

Bob Rivard [00:20:23]:
I think that's good news, actually.

Judge Peter Sakai [00:20:25]:
I'm excited about what the Rodeo can do, especially when they bring that commitment that I ask for them to do. What are you going to do for this community? What are you going to do for those kids in the east side? And they are following through. They're doing it now. And for the Spurs, I just value the fact they have established themselves, I believe contractually with the term sheet with the city of San Antonio, they will bind themselves to San Antonio. So I understand the pushback, so to speak, or the anti voice that Cox Metro said, they're bluffing. They're a business and they got a championship player in Winby and they have an opportunity to get back on a championship run. But they're a business. They've got to bring additional free agents and put things together, so to speak.

Judge Peter Sakai [00:21:10]:
And so I take their word. I take Peter John Holt's word when he says we're not leaving town, but we need a new spurs arena in order to be a sustainable business plan to support the players and the employees and the job development. Think about all the construction. That's another part of this commitment. I'm going to make sure as county judge, I want to make sure that the small businesses, women and minority owned businesses, especially those in the east side, are going to get a significant contribution in any of the contracts that are going to be let out. I would hope the city would do the same for whatever structure. And the spurs have made that commitment with me because we did that with, as you said, the SBC Center AT&T center, the first iteration name. That was something that was done by our small business entrepreneurship department who's led by our great department leader, Renee Watson.

Judge Peter Sakai [00:22:12]:
She made sure and that has been documented, that was a promise fulfilled back when they built the SBC center at&t, what, 20 years ago. And so we, we have a track record of making sure we did. Now what happened in my opinion in regards to the fulfillment of the east side, nothing was put into writing. And so the other dynamic, I hope the public will understand, there is no contract that's already spelled out. We have from now, if there's a favorable outcome to Referendum A and B, to work out a contract that will bind all the parties to all the stipulations and commitments. And so I want to make sure that the community gets back its benefit. But I first believe that what we need to do is allow the spurs to move up, so to speak, and to develop their business plan, but make sure that all the community benefit, and I believe that's one of the terms of the current term sheet between the spurs and the city is a community benefit. I really hope that the community, through that term sheet with the city of San Antonio, will allow the community to have direct input on the money that the spurs have committed to support our community, especially for the children and families.

Judge Peter Sakai [00:23:33]:
And so, yeah, as you know, Bob, we still have a lot of problems and issues, right? Poverty, crime, all those socioeconomic issues. But I'm excited about the job development. I'm excited about the jobs I'm bringing to Bexar County. I'm excited about what these projects will create in regards to jobs. And so we know, Bob, you know, from the top at Washington, D.C. to Austin and down to local, we're going to go through some tough headwinds. We've got some public policies that are going to really impact as county judge, my first duty is to protect its citizens. I need to be ready when those snap cuts come in, when those Medicaid cuts come in, when how are we going to protect our citizens? And I will tell you, Bexar county is ready to go and is ready and prepared when those type of policies affect them.

Judge Peter Sakai [00:24:24]:
And unfortunately, with the shutdown, we're probably going to start seeing a lot of those issues pop up right now.

Bob Rivard [00:24:31]:
I think you're right that COPS is wrong. The spurs are not bluffing. They need a new arena. And if we want to stay a Spurs city, we're going to have to find a way to give them a new arena. And I think we found it so.

Judge Peter Sakai [00:24:43]:
Much, let me correct that because we're not giving the Spurs a new arena. Let's push back and correct that misperception or misinformation. The city and the county and the spurs will create a local government entity. That local governmental entity will own the arena. We're not just going to build it with public finance and then, oh, spurs, here's the title and the keys to the building and we're done. No, they're going to pay rent. They're going to. There's all these financial incentives that are in the current term sheet that will assure that the spurs are going to have to pay the rent and they're going to have to help maintain that facility.

Judge Peter Sakai [00:25:18]:
And the city will and the county will be participating. Same template for the baseball stadium. One of the things is that we had the same discussion, in fact with cops, Metro. We don't need another baseball stadium. Just fix up the old Nelson Wolf. You probably know the answer to that one. And so I said no homeowner property tax, substantial equity by the baseball ownership. And three, we couldn't do a corporate welfare.

Judge Peter Sakai [00:25:46]:
Here's the building, the keys. So that is the template we're using for this new spurs arena and for the county facility. So I believe we have an opportunity to make a win win situation, which is the essence of good governance.

Bob Rivard [00:26:01]:
I think that's, that's an important distinction you just made. And I think we should add to the economic value of, of everything we're talking about. Both the spurs and the Stock show and Rodeo are part of our cultural fabric. They're part of our identity as a city. And they're part of the reason why when you go to Japan, people know about us and come here and what distinguishes us from other cities. And I think people need to think long and hard about what kind of city would we be if these entities weren't here and weren't as vital as they are and weren't growing. And it would be a very different city and it'd be a very less attractive city to other people on the outside coming in. So I think there's that too.

Bob Rivard [00:26:38]:
But.

Judge Peter Sakai [00:26:38]:
And we have an example of what happens when we have that void when there's a loss. The corporation at&t when they literally kind of left in the middle of the night. We've had a loss with nustar that merged with another major corporation but does not have really a local presence. People don't realize that those type of good corporate partners that gave back AT and T under Ed Whitaker gave Signi. And I will tell you the reason why. I know because it's children's court. AT&T gave over millions of dollars to our children's Court that continues to be a nationally renowned court with the technology. And we were ahead of the curve 20 years ago with video conferencing.

Judge Peter Sakai [00:27:20]:
I mean, if you think about it as we know that wasn't existing back then, but AT&T made that commitment for children and families. We know that. New star Bill Greehee. What's his legacy? Haven for Hope. Now, we know there's still a lot of problems with homelessness, but we have been ahead of the curve in our community. That is the vision that these individuals have done for our community. And I hope to do and continue to do as your county judge.

Bob Rivard [00:27:50]:
Thank you for your public service, Judge Sakai, over the years and now as county judge. And thanks for coming into Big City Small Town today. And we'll. We'll see you at the polls.

Judge Peter Sakai [00:27:59]:
We'll see you at the polls. But can I get you and I have a common interest. That's Cortisone Ministries. They're doing a heck of a job protecting our children and families.

Bob Rivard [00:28:07]:
I agree. They've been on our podcast. They'll be on again and they're a very worthy cause for somebody looking to put their charitable dollars to work in the community. Thanks again for coming in.

Judge Peter Sakai [00:28:17]:
Thank you, Bob.

Bob Rivard [00:28:22]:
As we approach this podcast, 150th episode later this year, we'll be adding some new sponsors that reflect the robust growth we've enjoyed this year after welcoming producer and co host Corey Ames to our enterprise, launching our YouTube channel and our weekly Monday Musings newsletter. If you do not yet subscribe to my free digital commentary, I hope you'll do so now by going to our Big City Small Town website and clicking on newsletters. The local media presence in San Antonio has been steadily shrinking since 2007. Believe me, I've experienced it personally, first as the executive editor at the San Antonio express news from 1997 to 2011, and then as we launched the Rivard report into 2012, where I worked until 2022. If your company or organization would like to consider supporting our local journalism and programming as a sponsor, please drop me a line via social media or to my email@robertjrevardmail.com Big City Small Town is brought to you by Western Urban Building a city our children want to call home, and by Geekdom, where startups are born and smart ideas become businesses. Thanks to Corey Ames of Ensemble, Texas, for the production of this show. We will see you next week.